47 Elizabeth II, A.D. 1998, Canada

Journals of the Senate

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Issue 95

Tuesday, November 24, 1998
2:00 p.m.

The Honourable Gildas L. Molgat, Speaker

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The Members convened were:

The Honourable Senators

Adams, Andreychuk, Angus, Atkins, Bacon, Beaudoin, Berntson, Bolduc, Bryden, Buchanan, Butts, Callbeck, Carstairs, Chalifoux, Cochrane, Cohen, Comeau, Cook, Cools, Corbin, DeWare, Di Nino, Doody, Fairbairn, Ferretti Barth, Fitzpatrick, Forrestall, Fraser, Gauthier, Gill, Grafstein, Graham, Hervieux-Payette, Johnson, Joyal, Kelly, Kenny, Keon, Kinsella, Kirby, Kolber, Kroft, Lavoie-Roux, LeBreton, Losier-Cool, Lucier, Lynch-Staunton, Maheu, Mahovlich, Maloney, Meighen, Mercier, Milne, Molgat, Moore, Murray, Nolin, Oliver, Pearson, Pépin, Perrault, Poulin (Charette), Poy, Prud'homme, Roberge, Robertson, Robichaud, (L'Acadie-Acadia), Robichaud , (Saint-Louis-de-Kent), Roche, Rompkey, Rossiter, Ruck, St. Germain, Simard, Sparrow, Spivak, Stewart, Stollery, Stratton, Taylor, Watt, Whelan

The Members in attendance to business were:

The Honourable Senators

Adams, Andreychuk, Angus, Atkins, Bacon, Beaudoin, Berntson, Bolduc, Bryden, Buchanan, Butts, Callbeck, Carstairs, Chalifoux, Cochrane, Cohen, Comeau, Cook, Cools, Corbin, DeWare, Di Nino, Doody, Fairbairn, Ferretti Barth, Fitzpatrick, Forrestall, Fraser, Gauthier, Gill, Grafstein, Graham, Hervieux-Payette, Johnson, *Johnstone, Joyal, *Kelleher, Kelly, Kenny, Keon, Kinsella, Kirby, Kolber, Kroft, Lavoie-Roux, LeBreton, Losier-Cool, Lucier, Lynch-Staunton, Maheu, Mahovlich, Maloney, Meighen, Mercier, Milne, Molgat, Moore, Murray, Nolin, Oliver, Pearson, Pépin, Perrault, *Phillips, Poulin (Charette), Poy, Prud'homme, Roberge, Robertson, Robichaud , (L'Acadie-Acadia), Robichaud , (Saint-Louis-de-Kent), Roche, Rompkey, Rossiter, Ruck, St. Germain, Simard, Sparrow, Spivak, Stewart, Stollery, Stratton, Taylor, Watt, Whelan

PRAYERS

SENATORS' STATEMENTS

Some Honourable Senators made statements.

DAILY ROUTINE OF BUSINESS

Presentation of Reports from Standing or Special Committees

The Honourable Senator Milne presented the following:

TUESDAY, November 24, 1998

The Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs has the honour to present its

FIFTEENTH REPORT

Your Committee, to which was referred Bill C-25, An Act to amend the National Defence Act and to make consequential amendments to other Acts, has, in obedience to the Order of Reference of Thursday, June 18, 1998, examined the said Bill and now reports the same with the following amendment and observations:

1. Page 89, Clause 96: Replace lines 1 to 6 with the following:

"96. (1) The Minister shall cause an independent review of the provisions and operation of this Act to be undertaken from time to time.

(2) The Minister shall cause the report on a review conducted under subsection (1) to be laid before each House of Parliament within five years after the day on which this Act is assented to, and within every five year period following the tabling of a report under this subsection.".

The Committee is generally supportive of Bill C-25 which embodies much needed amendments to the National Defence Act and, indeed, constitutes the most significant package of amendments to that Act since it was first enacted in 1950. However, the Committee does have some concerns about certain aspects of the bill. Having amended clause 96 of the bill to ensure that regular independent reviews of the provisions and operation of the proposed legislation are conducted, the Committee expects the Department of National Defence to have considered and addressed these concerns in the course of the first legislative review, if not before.

While we appreciate the steps taken in clause 42 of the bill to strengthen the institutional independence of military judges (specifically, making military judges Governor in Council appointees, as is the case with other federally appointed judges; lengthening the term of appointment to a fixed term of five years; and establishing special advisory committees on the appointment, re-appointment and remuneration of military judges), Committee members find the retention of renewable terms for military judges to be troubling, particularly when compared with other federally appointed judges who serve until a fixed retirement age. Moreover, members of the Committee are concerned that clause 42 of the bill would leave entirely to the regulations the composition of the proposed Renewal Committee as well as the criteria which that committee would use in making its recommendations to the executive on the re-appointment of military judges. The Committee is of the view that such important matters should be spelled out in such a way as to clearly preclude the possibility of improper interference in the re-appointment process.

Indeed, the Committee has a general concern about the number of important matters pertaining to the military justice system which will continue to be implemented by means of regulations - to be specific, the Queen's Regulations and Orders for the Canadian Forces - that are exempt from the usual process of publication in the Canada Gazette and parliamentary scrutiny under the Statutory Instruments Act.

The Committee is also concerned about the difference in the security of tenure between the proposed new positions of Director of Military Prosecutions and Director of Defence Counsel Services, which are dealt with in clauses 42 and 82 of the bill, respectively. It was noted that, while the recommendation of a special Inquiry Committee would be required for the removal from office of the Director of Military Prosecutions, the bill contemplates no such safeguard for the Director of Defence Counsel Services. This discrepancy is of concern in light of the Director of Defence Counsel Services' responsibility for the representation of accused persons who would then be in an adversarial relationship with the chain of command - a chain of command which includes the Minister of National Defence, the person responsible for the Director's appointment, re-appointment and possible removal from office.

Finally, the Committee supports the recommendation of the Special Advisory Group on Military Justice and Military Police Investigation Services headed by the late Brian Dickson, that the Code of Service Discipline be re-enacted as a separate statute. While the Committee appreciates the difficulty of incorporating such a change into the extensive set of amendments proposed in Bill C-25, we urge the Department of National Defence to proceed as quickly as possible with the implementation of this recommendation.

Respectfully submitted,

LORNA MILNE

Chair

The Honourable Senator Milne moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Butts, that the Report be placed on the Orders of the Day for consideration at the next sitting.

The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.

Government Notices of Motions

With leave of the Senate, The Honourable Senator Carstairs moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Rompkey, P.C.:

That when the Senate adjourns today, it do stand adjourned until tomorrow, Wednesday, November 25, 1998, at 1:30 p.m.

The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.

ORDERS OF THE DAY

GOVERNMENT BUSINESS

Bills

Third reading of Bill C-52, An Act to implement the Comprehensive Nuclear Test-Ban Treaty, as amended.

The Honourable Senator Corbin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Ferretti Barth, that the Bill, as amended, be read the third time.

After debate, The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.

The Bill, as amended, was then read the third time and passed.

Ordered, That a Message be sent to the House of Commons to acquaint that House that the Senate have passed this Bill, with an amendment, to which they desire their concurrence. Second reading of Bill C-51, An Act to amend the Criminal Code, the Controlled Drugs and Substances Act and the Corrections and Conditional Release Act.

The Honourable Senator Moore moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Lucier, that the Bill be read the second time.

After debate, The Honourable Senator DeWare for the Honourable Senator Ghitter moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Atkins, that further debate on the motion be adjourned until the next sitting.

The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.

OTHER BUSINESS

Senate Public Bills

Order No. 1 was called and postponed until the next sitting.

Commons Public Bills

Order No. 1 was called and postponed until the next sitting.

Reports of Committees

Order No. 1 was called and postponed until the next sitting. Consideration of the Twenty-seventh Report of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration (budgets of certain committees), presented in the Senate on November 19, 1998.

The Honourable Senator Rompkey, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Taylor, that the Report be adopted.

The question being put on the motion, it was adopted. Consideration of the Twenty-eighth Report of the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration (pay scales of unrepresented employees), presented in the Senate on November 19, 1998.

The Honourable Senator Rompkey, P.C., moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Robichaud, P.C. (Saint-Louis-de-Kent), that the Report be adopted.

The question being put on the motion, it was adopted. Orders No. 4 to 6 were called and postponed until thenext sitting.

Other

Orders No. 44, 15, 34 (inquiries), 1 (other), 88 (motion),42, 23, 41 (inquiries), 45 and 1 (motions) were called and postponed until the next sitting. Resuming debate on the inquiry of the Honourable Senator Losier-Cool, calling the attention of the Senate to population, education and health, particularly for young girls and women in many developing countries.

After debate, The Honourable Senator Pépin moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Poulin, that further debate on the inquiry be adjourned until the next sitting.

The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.

INQUIRIES

The Honourable Senator Kinsella called the attention of the Senate to the Responses to the Supplementary Questions emitted by the United Nations Committee on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights on Canada's Third Report on the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights.

After debate, The Honourable Senator Cohen moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Stratton, that further debate on the inquiry be adjourned until the next sitting.

The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.

MOTIONS

The Honourable Senator Taylor moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Mahovlich:

That notwithstanding the Order of the Senate adopted on November 18, 1997, to examine matters relating to the present state and future of forestry in Canada, the Standing Senate Committee on Agriculture and Forestry be empowered to present its final report no later than June 30, 1999; and

That the Committee be permitted, notwithstanding usual practices, to deposit its report with the Clerk of the Senate, if the Senate is not then sitting; and that the report be deemed to have been tabled in the Chamber.

After debate, The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.

REPORTS DEPOSITED WITH THE CLERK OF THE SENATE PURSUANT TO RULE 28(2):

Report of the Canada Deposit Insurance Corporation on the administration of the Alternative Fuels Act for the fiscal year ended March 31, 1998, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20, s. 8.-Sessional Paper No. 1/36-927.

Summaries of the Corporate Plans for 1998-99 to 2002-03 and of the Operating and Capital Budgets for 1998-99 of theSt. Lawrence Seaway Authority and its subsidiaries, pursuant to the Financial Administration Act, R.S.C. 1985, c. F-11,sbs. 125(4).-Sessional Paper No. 1/36-928.

ADJOURNMENT

The Honourable Senator Carstairs moved, seconded by the Honourable Senator Moore:

That the Senate do now adjourn.

The question being put on the motion, it was adopted.

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Changes in Membership of Committees Pursuant to Rule 85(4)

Special Joint Committee on Child Custody and Access

The name of the Honourable Senator Losier-Cool substituted for that of the Honourable Senator Maloney (November 19).

The name of the Honourable Senator Maloney substituted for that of the Honourable Senator Losier-Cool (November 23).

Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples

The name of the Honourable Senator Beaudoin removed from the membership (November 20).

Standing Senate Committee on Agriculture and Forestry

The names of the Honourable Senators Chalifoux and Adams substituted for those of the Honourable Senators Milne and Whelan (November 23).

Standing Senate Committee on Legal and Constitutional Affairs

The names of the Honourable Senators Pépin and Buchanan substituted for those of the Honourable Senators Rompkey and Forrestall (November 23).

Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration

The name of the Honourable Senator Poulin substituted for that of the Honourable Senator Joyal (November 23).

Standing Senate Committee on Social Affairs, Science and Technology

The names of the Honourable Senators Chalifoux and Maloney substituted for those of the Honourable Senators Maloney and Chalifoux (November 24).

Standing Committee on Privileges, Standing Rules and Orders

The name of the Honourable Senator DeWare substituted for that of the Honourable Senator Grimard (November 24).

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